16 replies to this topic

[mixedup]

Just for upcoming budgetary purposes (not ready to buy yet) how much should one budget for their first rig?  Or say a rough price range.  Assumptions would be:

* 2nd hand
* including main / reserve / Cypress / container etc  [not including altimeter etc]
* size - not sure I get around 190 for the main perhaps
* jumps - say for use after say the first 20 jumps (I'm assuming here, haven't checked, that one would be financially better off to buy your own rig than to keep renting at this stage - also kind of assuming the rig you buy itself will retain some value)

Just a rough indication would be good - the reason I asked is I've read some sites saying you could get one from between $2500-$4000, then in other places some suggesting $6000.   I guess it depends what they meant was included, but what I've asked for about is the complete rig (with reserve, Cypress etc).

[Peterpan]

mixedup, on 11 July 2011 - 10:04 AM, said:

Just for upcoming budgetary purposes (not ready to buy yet) how much should one budget for their first rig?  Or say a rough price range.  Assumptions would be:

* 2nd hand
* including main / reserve / Cypress / container etc  [not including altimeter etc]
* size - not sure I get around 190 for the main perhaps
* jumps - say for use after say the first 20 jumps (I'm assuming here, haven't checked, that one would be financially better off to buy your own rig than to keep renting at this stage - also kind of assuming the rig you buy itself will retain some value)

Just a rough indication would be good - the reason I asked is I've read some sites saying you could get one from between $2500-$4000, then in other places some suggesting $6000.   I guess it depends what they meant was included, but what I've asked for about is the complete rig (with reserve, Cypress etc).

You need to be thinking in the $5500.00-$6000.00 be a good set on gear  that you can uses for everything.

[MattyHylander]

$6k should get you something with very low jump numbers and only a couple of years old me thinks.
$3-4k would get you something very decent.

My rig is a 2000mdl Jav, full stainless, articulated and had 350-400 jumps on it, came with a Saber 150 and a cypres with a few years left on it and is in awesome condition and that cost me $3200

Check DZ.com - Lots of awesome rigs to be had!
Size wise - A chat to your CI will let you know what to buy!

[mixedup]

MattyHylander, on 11 July 2011 - 10:23 AM, said:

$3-4k would get you something very decent.

thanks - so something decent does mean with an AAD? (just double-checking)  Also from a pure safety point of view the rig would be as safe as a $6k 2nd hand rig?   Like I wouldn't care if it visually doesn't look new or anything, but just needs to be as safe as a more expensive 2nd hand rig or new rig.  Maybe another way to ask the question would be if you were looking at a $3k-4k rig and you get a rigger to OK it, then there should be no reason why you need to pay another $2000 for safety?  (hope that makes sense)

[Gravity7]

A list of priorities may help. My views...(not necessarily in order, they all count)

1) A harness that fits well - don't go by how tall/heavy the seller is, compared to yourself, it is torso length that counts.
2) Canopy sizes - don't be in a rush to go small, make sure your reserve is large enough. The container should be a good fit for the canopies, not the other way around
3) Colour means NOTHING. Fashion can go **** itself.
4) Don't feel you have to compromise one aspect of a SYSTEM, in order to buy a particular rig. You can buy different bits from different people, as long as they will go together properly.
5) Consult your CI and rigger BEFORE you buy anything.
6) An AAD can be moved from this rig to your next one, so remaining life of the AAD should not be too short, or it will cost you more in the longer term.
7) There is LOTS of 2nd-hand gear out there, don't go for the first one that seems right, shop around and you can end up with a better system, at a better total cost.
8) Don't buy stuff online. Finding stuff online is OK, then get it delivered to a DZ for proper inspection by a rigger. Get them to use the APF inspection form, and ensure they SIGN it. It is worth the small extra cost of getting this done.
9) Don't pay for gear that is not already in trusted hands. Too many people have been ripped off, getting gear they cannot use, or even not getting the gear at all.

Just because we APPEAR to be a big family does not mean you can trust everyone.

[GoldenBrown]

Gravity7, on 11 July 2011 - 11:42 AM, said:

1) A harness that fits well - don't go by how tall/heavy the seller is, compared to yourself, it is torso length that counts.
2) ..........

I'd follow Gravity's suggestion, a well-fitted harness makes the jumping experience a whole lot more pleasurable than buying one that just looks good but leaves you with a sore back.

First rig will likely be the one that gets into dirt from the occasional shoddy landing, and unless its modded to be safe enough to be used in freefly, may restrict your jump choices i.e. exposed bridle, loose riser-covers etc... though many of these things can be fixed at a cost from a reputable rigger.

I tried on different containers from the guys at my dropzone to get an idea of the MLW and yoke sizes. Certainly helped me out as I would've probably gotten a container that was too big for me even though the seller is my height/weight.

Canopy size should be discussed with your CI.

My first rig was put together from pieces that I purchased separately over the time I did my B-rels, worked out a lot cheaper than buying something that was already put together. Aside from the AAD which I bought brand new, the whole rig cost me $1400. My advice to buying things separately, is to check that the various parts/canopies etc are compatible with the container that you are buying (and vice versa), as not all canopies pack the same volume, regardless if they're the same size e.g Tempo 150 packs smaller than a PD143R. A rigger should be able to advise you on this if you have problems reading up/understanding the pack volumes and container sizes.

You should also check with them that the reserve and container are TSO approved and still within service life - some manufacturers have a service life on their equipment and/or require to be returned to the manufacturer for testing after a specific amount of time. Gear that may be approved overseas, aren't necessarily approved by the APF in Australia, so keep that in mind if you're eyeing off an older container.

Other things to consider - GST/import tax are applicable when buying gear over $1000 from overseas.

And if that hasn't confused you further... good luck with getting your first rig

[mixedup]

GoldenBrown, on 11 July 2011 - 12:58 PM, said:

the whole rig cost me $1400.

that sounds pretty good - so around $3200 in total including a new Cypress then?   Any particular reason you went for a new Cypress as opposed to 2nd hand?  (e.g. hard to find 2nd hand, or safety perhaps)...

[MattyHylander]

mixedup, on 11 July 2011 - 10:41 AM, said:

MattyHylander, on 11 July 2011 - 10:23 AM, said:

$3-4k would get you something very decent.

thanks - so something decent does mean with an AAD? (just double-checking)  Also from a pure safety point of view the rig would be as safe as a $6k 2nd hand rig?   Like I wouldn't care if it visually doesn't look new or anything, but just needs to be as safe as a more expensive 2nd hand rig or new rig.  Maybe another way to ask the question would be if you were looking at a $3k-4k rig and you get a rigger to OK it, then there should be no reason why you need to pay another $2000 for safety?  (hope that makes sense)

Its all condition based really. You can get some really nice slightly older rigs that are just as safe and have the same options/features as a lot newer rig for $4k or you can also get an overpriced POS for $4k

Just like G7 has said - There are a lot of things that you need to take into consideration and it should all be done in consultation with a rigger and your CI, or at bare minimum your CI.

And yeah I meant with an AAD (But might only have a few years left on it)

[Johno]

Mine cost me $4500: 1997 T2 with AAD, harness fitted great, wing loadings all good: Had to replace the main with a new safire as it was rather porous. Get more than one opinion, in hindsight had I had known about the main I could have negotiated the price lower. Other than that, no problemo.

[GoldenBrown]

mixedup, on 11 July 2011 - 01:14 PM, said:

GoldenBrown, on 11 July 2011 - 12:58 PM, said:

the whole rig cost me $1400.

that sounds pretty good - so around $3200 in total including a new Cypress then?   Any particular reason you went for a new Cypress as opposed to 2nd hand?  (e.g. hard to find 2nd hand, or safety perhaps)...

When I bought my Cypres2, it was about $1200AUD new. I chose to get a new one for a couple of reasons, one being that there weren't many available when I was looking, and secondly buying new meant that I wouldn't have to worry about battery replacement/servicing for at least 4 years, plus, the AAD is transferable from rig to rig, so in the event of upgrading my rig, I could take that with me.

Again, its all down to how much you want to spend, plus what's available - once I had found out my own harness measurements, the options available to me became very slim but it wasn't impossible. Sent a lot of emails to sellers, got plenty of photos, plus more info on the condition of goods, and if I was happy with that, I negotiated on price/shipping.  

Another tip - If you find a complete rig for sale in Australia and you're pretty keen on purchasing based on the info/photos you've got, ask the seller if they are willing to ship the rig to your home DZ so that a) you can get it checked out by your CI and rigger, and b) jump it and see what you think. Obviously, you'll have to cover the shipping (both ways if you don't buy) , but it'll save you from handing over thousands of dollars on something that might not be quite right for you.

I didn't have a huge amount of money saved to spend on my first rig, but I did my homework, negotiated hard, and got some pretty good deals. As the others have mentioned, refer to your CI and rigger (if possible) for help, as they're the best sources for information.

[Luke Oliver]

Gravity7, on 11 July 2011 - 11:42 AM, said:

5) Consult your CI and rigger BEFORE you buy anything.

I'll say it so no-one else has to dance around it:

If your CI/Rigger/Instructor/newfound best buddies are also Dealers for New Harnesses etc, GET AN EXTERNAL OPINION before you sign on the dotted line for your first piece of shiny new manufactured equipment.

[Peterpan]

MattyHylander, on 11 July 2011 - 10:23 AM, said:

$6k should get you something with very low jump numbers and only a couple of years old me thinks.
$3-4k would get you something very decent.

My rig is a 2000mdl Jav, full stainless, articulated and had 350-400 jumps on it, came with a Saber 150 and a cypres with a few years left on it and is in awesome condition and that cost me $3200

Check DZ.com - Lots of awesome rigs to be had!
Size wise - A chat to your CI will let you know what to buy!

I would love to know were you are getting theses rig that are costing $3-4k, all readily to go that are modern and stay! Please tell me as I have 6 people looking for rigs right now and we are having great trouble finding anything for them.
So if you have something or know of anything let me know!!

[MattyHylander]

Peterpan, on 12 July 2011 - 09:35 AM, said:

MattyHylander, on 11 July 2011 - 10:23 AM, said:

$6k should get you something with very low jump numbers and only a couple of years old me thinks.
$3-4k would get you something very decent.

My rig is a 2000mdl Jav, full stainless, articulated and had 350-400 jumps on it, came with a Saber 150 and a cypres with a few years left on it and is in awesome condition and that cost me $3200

Check DZ.com - Lots of awesome rigs to be had!
Size wise - A chat to your CI will let you know what to buy!

I would love to know were you are getting theses rig that are costing $3-4k, all readily to go that are modern and stay! Please tell me as I have 6 people looking for rigs right now and we are having great trouble finding anything for them.
So if you have something or know of anything let me know!!

No problems. When you say modern, I never claimed anything to be almost new, I referenced it to a 10yo Jav. So that depends on what you call modern.
A quick look on DZ.com came up with the following links. I don't know your 6 people so wouldn't know the suitability of any of these for them...... Nor do I claim to be an expert.  But its an idea of whats out there.

Only thing is that you can't see the rig in the flesh first...... Just makes it a little riskier. I have bought stuff from OS before, my current rig (Jav, full stainless, articulated, tempo 150, saber 150, cypress all manufactured in 2000 with 400 jumps on it - $3200) I got from DZ.com and didn't have any hassels. I did a lot of homework though. Lots of communication and photos etc.

Complete V3
Older J2
V3 maybe for lightish chick?
G4, needs cypres but would come in at $5k
Bigger - $5k, bargain with the man

[Talon too]

Easy rule of thumb............Goood 2nd hand is roughly half of brand new gear ,should serve you well and also retain decent resale value.Doesnt mean you cant score a bargain or do well after a lot of research AND non biased (flogging the gear) assistance. And dont forget when you have made the decision cash talks.

[chooc]

hrmmm
so goin on this.....
a brand new everything.. ya lookin at 10ish grand then yeah ??

[hunty]

ive seen a number of brand new complete setups AAD/main/reserve/container for around 7700ish
the US dollar is good at the moment!
check out downward trend and see what packages they can do
also check out chutingstar, they are based in the states so will need to factor in gst and shipping.

personally id go for a nice 4-5k second hand setup and put 300 plus jumps on it and buy new once you know what you want.

[MattyHylander]

Matt Hill had recent dealings with a full new set of gear......... Wondering if he can help us out with rough import costs on top of the purchase price?????